“I’m really big at giving our girls an experience that they can’t get.”
Jackie Carson, the head coach of women’s basketball at Furman University, sits down with us in this episode of the 35,000 Feet podcast and talks about her journey. She shares how she become a basketball coach, her favorite travel experiences including playing overseas, and offers great advice for athletes wanting to play in college!
In this episode, we discuss:
How this past season went for Furman’s Women’s Basketball team (0:20)
How Coach Carson got into coaching (2:45)
Jackie’s favorite travel experience (5:46)
One thing that no one knows about Jackie (10:25)
Jackie’s advice to athletes wanting to play in college (13:36)
Jackie’s next adventure (15:39)
2019-2020 University of Furman’s Women’s Basketball Season
*This podcast was recorded on March 2nd, 2020
Shianne: So you're actually coming closer to the end of your 10th season. Can you tell us about how your season's going?
Jackie: Yeah. So as you mentioned, this is year 10 and we're in the Southern Conference. It's mostly all Southeast mid-major schools. And in preseason we were picked first. We only graduated one senior last year. We lost in the Southern Conference championship game in Asheville, North Carolina last year by three points to Mercer, who was the number one seat and hadn't lost in Southern conference play in two years. So graduated, like I said, just one senior from that team, have some pretty talented all-conference kids returning. So we're pretty competent on just being able to take that one more step and win a championship. And of course, within that, we've kind of gotten banged up and bruised up and also trying to deal with the pressure of being number one.
So we are now heading into our conference tournament. So our regular season is done and we played Thursday against Walker who we ironically just beat on Saturday. So we're playing them back to back and it's going to be a pretty great battle. So for early on, we are the four-seed. So actually one, two, and three all had matching records. Yeah, it's crazy. So we actually have only eight teams in our conference and three of them are saying they're the regular-season champs. So it's a really weird situation and we're that team that's a game or maybe two behind. So we played it Thursday and hopefully, we can get back to the championship game but have a different result this time.
Shianne: Yeah. And that's kind of crazy how tight everybody is in that conference with standings. I mean, the top three people kind of share that championship. The competition is so neck and neck.
Jackie: Yeah. I mean, everyone literally was beating up on everyone and that's... So the number one seed, we're the only team in the whole conference that beat them twice. Other than that, they have beat everyone at least once or swept everyone else. But we got swept by the two and three seed, which is kind of backwards. And so it was really weird. Even the eighth seed who was Western Carolina, they hadn't won a conference game, I think in two years. And they pulled out two or three wins this year. So it's just a really crazy conference... It's going to be a crazy but the regular season was wild.
Shianne: Yeah, and good luck with that, because when you start into that conference tournament, everything's kind of restarted and it's a clean slate for any team. Anybody can take it.
Jackie: Absolutely. March is crazy. So March Madness.
How Coach Jackie Carson’s Got Her Start in Coaching
Shianne: Yeah, March Madness, for sure. How did you get into coaching?
Jackie: Well, it's really weird, actually. I had zero desire to coach in college. So I'm really blessed to be at my Alma mater and so I played at Furman from 1996 to 2000 and I was a premed major. I thought I was going to go to med school and be a doctor, a PA, a physician's assistant. And so I was really just enjoying my career. And luckily I had a really blessed successful career while I was at Furman and I got the opportunity to play overseas. So I played in Belgium my first year out and I played in Israel the following year. And ironically went to Israel three months after 9/11, which is crazy scary. And I'm a military brat. So my dad is a pretty high ranking official in the military.
And he actually worked at the Pentagon at the time. So even super scarier that I played in Israel and then the following season, I was supposed to play in Russia. And I was like, "You know what? I'm not going to Russia. I'm good. I think I'm just going to kind of call it quits. I like stability. And playing overseas doesn't give you much, especially when you come home, you have no insurance, stuff like that." So I decided I would just go back and start getting my hours to apply for med school. And during that time I was getting my hours, but I also worked as a personal trainer in a gym in the Washington DC area. And one of the girls that I trained was a high school basketball athlete and she was pretty high profile. She ended up going to UVA, but she's like, "Hey, do you want to help coach my AAU team?"
I was like, "Well, sure. I still love basketball. I still want to be around it, still played around in Northern Virginia area." So started coaching an AAU team, Fairfax Stars out of Northern Virginia. From there, that team was loaded, we ended up winning the national championship when that was a big thing. Now it's kind of dying down. But my college assistant coach is like, "Hey, there's a position open at Bucknell. You want to give this college thing a try?" And I was like, "No." He's like, "No, you're going to be really, really good, try it." And I was like, "Okay." I was like, "Well, it doesn't hurt to go interview." So I interviewed, ended up getting the job and the rest is history. I spent two years at Bucknell and spent five years at James Madison and then got the head coaching job here 10 years ago, almost. So it's been quite... When you're going in one direction and then all of a sudden you make a sharp right and you're going in another direction, that's pretty much my history.
Shianne: How cool. That's so cool that you're able to go back to where you played and be a coach there now, too. That's awesome.
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely. It's fun. At first it's one of those scary things because people tend to associate your coaching career with how you played. And like I said, I had a really good career here, but coaching is way harder than playing. I had control when I was a player. I have no control now. I just pray that they listen.
Shianne: Yeah, "Please listen to me."
Jackie: Please do it, please.
Coach Jackie Carson’s Favorite Travel Experiences
Shianne: That's awesome. So you mentioned that you kind of got to play overseas. Can you talk a little bit more about maybe some of your favorite travel experiences, whether it's playing or coaching?
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely. So like I said, my first job was in Belgium and that was... I am a military brat. My dad was 31 years in the Army. I have three older brothers, but I was the only one out of the four kids who had never lived out of the country until I was able to play professionally. So my brothers had lived in Germany and then I was born right after we moved back to the States. So it was pretty cool to just be able to go to Europe, super scary. I probably needed that independence. I'm definitely a daddy's girl, but I was always up under my mom the whole time in high school and everything like that. So going over to a European country for months at a time, just by yourself playing basketball was definitely eye-opening. But I love Europe. The food is so great. In Belgium, I ate all the time. And I don't like eating chains. I like eating different stuff and trying different stuff. So I was able to travel all over the place when I played in Belgium. Came home and then went to Israel.
And Israel is one of the most phenomenal countries because you kind of have a vision of what you just see on TV in the US and I was just thinking deserts and tanks and stuff like that. And I lived in Ranana, which is right outside of Tel-Aviv, which is on the beach. And it was beautiful and Tel-Aviv is beautiful and it was kind of the first time experiencing kosher food. And most people speak English and it was just a really, really cool experience. And I've just as I said, I've traveled, especially when I was in Belgium, I traveled to the Netherlands and I've been to Spain and stuff like that. The only place I never went that I always wanted to go was Paris because for some reason, every time I tried to go, the trains were on strike. I never knew how much the trains were on strike until I lived in Europe. So, yeah, it was a really, really cool experience and I have some great traveling memories.
Shianne: Yeah. And do you get to travel anywhere with your teams, I mean either in-country or out of the country?
Jackie: Yeah. So I'm really big at trying to give our girls an experience that they can't get. I think that's one thing that my coach did really well when I was at Furman is just making us stay in different places or traveling all over a different country. I admit though, the only place I'll go that's really, really cold is New York because of Times Square, otherwise, I'm going to pure warmth all the time. So we've traveled to tournaments in Florida the last couple of years. I want to get them out to California because I don't think I have a lot of kids that have ever seen the West coast. We did a foreign tour to Spain this past August, which was amazing. I mean, more than half of our team didn't even have a passport before the foreign tours. We did 10 days in Spain and traveled all over Barcelona and Madrid and Valencia, which was really, really cool. And I had never been to Spain. When I was at James Madison we went to Italy as a team. So it was really cool to be able to share that experience with the girls.
Shianne: Yeah. Wow. It sounds like you've had some really cool places you got to go as a player and also as a coach.
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I love traveling with my family to the Caribbean and just all over the United States. As a military brat, I've lived all over. But just being able to travel and see different things within the US and then also abroad is pretty special.
Shianne: Yeah. It's super special. I feel like you've learned a lot of lessons too, just not even knowing it as you're going and all the culture and the experiences. And it's cool.
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely, because you got to kind of become a chameleon. You don't want to offend anyone. You want to learn cultures. You want to embrace the experience. I think that's one of the things that we talked about with our team, "When you go to Barcelona, nine o'clock is when everything is kicking off, 10 o'clock at night." So restaurants that have a little siesta in the middle of the day where restaurants and shops are not open because they're preparing for stuff. So we really talked to them about embracing the culture of wherever you are and not doing... We don't eat at chains. I hate eating at chains on the road, even now. So when we travel, whatever city we're going to, we're going to eat at somewhere that we don't have in Greenville. So that's something I like to do. I want them to try different stuff and have a different experience because I think that's paid off during my career.
Shianne: Yeah. I love that. I love how you mentioned not eating at different chains because I'm the same way when I travel. I'm like, "No guys, we have this at our house. Why would we eat here when we're all across the country? It doesn't make sense. Let's try something new."
Jackie: Absolutely. It doesn't. If you don't go to Philly and get a cheesesteak, that doesn't make sense. If you don't go to New England and get seafood.... just none of that stuff makes sense. So we definitely try to experience whatever, regionally, is the most popular dishes and stuff like that.
A Fun Fact About Coach Jackie Carson
Shianne: Yeah. I love that. Awesome. Well, I'm going to put you on the spot here a little bit. But what is the one thing that no one knows about you that you can share with us?
Jackie: Oh, gosh. Well, I won't say no one because obviously my husband and my kids. But I love to draw and a lot of my art is in my mom's house. I don't get to do it as much as I used to, but I took art lessons and I took... My mom stuck me in everything. So I was really a pretty accomplished tennis player as well. A lot of people don't know that, and then I had scholarships to play volleyball and... but yeah, I played tennis and I'm a pretty good artist.
Shianne: Wow. And you had a scholarship for volleyball, too?
Jackie: Yeah. I put in one year of high school volleyball and ended up getting a scholarship offer. But I thought it was probably safer to stick with basketball.
Shianne: Wow. That's awesome. Do your kids... I mean, they're probably little, right?
Jackie: They are, they're eight and six. Two girls.
Shianne: Oh cute. Do they like to draw or play sports or how does that play into them?
Jackie: They do. So my oldest is eight and her name London. And so if anyone's ever watched the movie, Remember the Titans, she's the little girl, the assistant coach's daughter in the movie. That's her and she comes into the locker room after the game and she's way more critical. Like, "You guys on defense, you need to do this." And she's on it. She's like, "Oh, these officials are bad." So I had to work with her a little bit. "We can't blame the officials, we got to do better." But she's really, really good at soccer and she wants to be a WNBA player. Now my youngest is six. Her name is Lathyn and she's slowly getting into the sports scene. But I just remember we went to a... So this year Greenville, South Carolina, where we are, is hosting the SEC tournament and they hosted the SEC women's tournament a couple of years ago.
So we took the girls. And so Lathyn, miss typical Lathyn, she wants to be a ballerina. But bless her heart, she's probably going to be at least 6'5". So the tallest ballerina in the history of ballet. Just the whole game, London's locked in and Lathyn like, "Oh." It's South Carolina versus Mississippi State. And she's like, "Oh mommy, look at the bulldog and the chicken." So she's just looking at the mascots. And so she slowly... She's my biggest fan. She tells me, "You know I'm your biggest fan, mommy." And she's so proud that mommy is a head coach and that's so amazing to her. So she enjoys it from just a different set of lenses.
Shianne: That is so cute. I love that. Thanks for sharing that. I know I kind of didn't really ask you about that, but I love hearing how the family plays a role in everybody and their position.
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely. And then, my husband is actually an academic. Or he's an assistant AD here at Furman. So we're kind of like a package family deal around here. And he does all the academics for all the student-athletes. So thank God for him. And then my girls keep me grounded and it just kind of helps me be a better coach at the end of the day.
Shianne: Yeah. That's awesome. It's a family affair. Everybody's involved.
Jackie: Absolutely.
Coach Jackie Carson’s Advice to Athletes Wanting to Play in College
Shianne: If you're an athlete wanting to play for a collegiate team, what's your advice to them?
Jackie: Yeah. I think you have to really be passionate about it. I know a lot of kids say, "I want to play at the next level," but don't really envision what that takes. I think you need to... There's so much accessibility now, especially with the recruiting rules. You really need to go watch a practice and study the game. One of the things that's being lost by high school kids, I think now, is just studying the game and understanding the game of basketball. It's not just playing AAU and going out in there and getting exposure. It's about really understanding the game and what it takes to be successful.
I think Sabrina Lonescu just talked about that. She wanted to practice harder than anyone else. And that was one of the things that she learned from Kobe Bryant. And that is literally starting to become a recruiting tool, kids that play hard and really want to invest. So I would suggest go watch practices and visit with coaches and ask them what they're looking for and what they see. And really see if that's something you want to do. Because right now, if you play hard and you're passionate about the sport, it's so obvious and you won't have a problem being recruited.
Shianne: Yeah. I love that. I think that's such great advice because I feel like being a smart player kind of separates you from maybe the flashy player, who's super talented and flashy, but they're not super smart with their decisions on the court. So I really like that.
Jackie: Yeah, you're exactly right. Just having a basketball knowledge right now is a separator. I think that's one of the things, when UConn was at it’s best, you had all American kids that had the talent, but also ran a system and understood how the game was being played. And that was the separator. And now you're just having more and more programs match that. So it's not just about that athletic program, there's a lot more systems. And like I said, the basketball side of it is just, everyone's a little bit more knowledgeable. So I think that's what starting to even out the playing field in the women's side.
Shianne: Yeah, for sure. I think that's awesome. I really liked your insight there. Thanks for sharing that.
Jackie: Yeah, of course.
Coach Jackie Carson’s Next Adventure with Her Team
Shianne: Just as we kind of wrap it up, Jackie, can you kind of tell us about what's your next adventure? What's up next?
Jackie: Yeah. So as we finish up the season, hopefully we... We'll play three games this weekend and then see what post-season looks like. Obviously dreams of playing an NCAA tournament. And then honestly once the season is over, I serve on a number of committees with the NCAA and I'm on the WBCA. So just making sure... At the final four I love getting insight on how to be better. And then I truly am looking forward to unplugging a little bit and spending time with my family because the season was so long, especially with the foreign tour and looking for some places to travel. So if any of the listeners or anyone has a suggestion, send them my way, I would love to hear them. But I think it's just really big to unplug after the season. And so I don't know where that's going to be yet, but I'm looking forward to finding out and taking some time off.
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Theme Song - I’ll Just Be Me by Gravity Castle